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maecar

increased suicide in ppl with pituitary tumors

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Karen,

 

I just read in your signature that your surgery is... tomorrow! My thoughts and prayers are with you. You will be on the OTHER SIDE soon! YAY!

 

And I must agree with Judy... I'm really enjoying this post. It's good to know you're not alone, although I wish it was under better circumstances.

 

Loss of hope is a huge reason I become suicidal. This seems to pop up over and over again.

 

I wish I could add more insightful words but since I'm in the same boat, I'm just here to commiserate and perhaps say nothing of any value. =/

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I've debated whether or not to post on this. I never want to share this part of my feelings with anyone, for fear it will be taken to mean I am suicidal. I have days, I just want to die. But for me, it is not that I want to kill myself, I just wish I could die. I feel so bad physically, that I just don't want to deal with it. There is some kind of threshold we cross somewhere in there. When you are feeling good, or just ok, you don't want to die. Nobody really wants to die in normal circumstances. But, when you reach a certain point, you just don't care! Dying would be a welcomed relief, honestly.

 

I have never wanted to hurt myself. And, I have never seriously considered killing myself, although I can say the thoughts have run through my mind of, "if I were to do it, how would I do it" type thing. I just know not to dwell on it. I put it out of my mind and move on.

 

I fear even speaking those words out loud. One thing is that my mother had tried to commit suicide at least once that I know of. I believe she had Cushing's, for other reasons than this, but I think this was part of it. She was labeled. She was a crazy person. She was not mentally right. She had severe depression, she was manic, etc. Ever since I was a child, I have had a major fear of being labled as my mom was, and thrown into a catagory and forgotten. Chalk everything up to the fact she is mental! I finally told my NP one time that I was depressed, and she gave me medicine. I don't currently take any. If it was not for testing, I would probably ask for it again. When I have my normal times, I don't need any medicine at all. When I am going through this garbage, I feel like I need medicine, but the thing is, I have always felt that it is only a symptom, and I don't want to mask the real problem. If you say you are depressed, you run the risk of a Dr. thinking that is the cause of your problems, not a symptom that comes from the other physical problems going on!

 

Religiously speaking, I do not believe suicide is right. Please don't think I am being judgemental. It is just the way I believe. So, I would not do this to myself. I would not put my family through more trauma and grief. However, I do understand that when a person gets to that place, it is not because they are being selfish and only thinking of themselves. I have heard this statement before from someone very close. Statements like that make you not open up to others! People on the outside, who do not have a chronic disease, do not understand at all! On this side of it, we understand perfectly!

 

I have lots of friends and family, but this is the only place I have felt like I fit in. What I mean is, if I talk to family or friends and ask if they have had this symptom or that symptom, they say no. Ok, so that ends the conversation pretty quickly. They are probably thinking, "Ok, you are weird. I've never had that or heard of that before." It makes me clam up and feel isolated. I feel like even though I have been living in society, I am isolated in my own little world. That is, until I found this site. Once I talked to you guys, and realized that we connected with everything, I felt so normal and happy to find someone who understands, and that I can feel comfortable talking about what I am feeling.

 

My faith in God keeps my going through the rough times. I know he helps me, or I wouldnt' be here. I believe in God and his promises to us. He said he would not give us more than we could handle, and I believe that. He did not say it would not be hard at times, but he will help us through it if we let him.

 

I am so thankful for this site and all the help we are able to give each other. Talking to others when we are feeling low, and discouraged with testing or anything else, really helps to keep us going! Medicine is not bad, but sometimes, all it takes is someone to understand!

 

Gracie

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Now I have never had a suicidal thought in my life. It has never crossed my mind to hurt myself. However, there have been times when I very likely could have killed someone else. I am not that type of person and it was this type of thinking that made me realize that something in my life had changed. Ultimately this has led me here and to a Cushing's dx and surgery next week.

I am a very positive, upbeat, friendly, laughing, smiling, individual. With homicidal tendencies. :)

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Phil, that's what they say about alot of serial killers, "but he seemed like such a nice guy"!!!

 

Seriously, you wonder what is going on in the inner workings of their bodies and do they do any kind of physical testing on them once they are caught.

 

Judy

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.............somewhere, and i cant remember where.......but it was a reliable cushings source.......

 

.............it was said "suicide is the no. 2 cause of death among people with cushings. (thats all i can remember and it was years ago i heard it. i am assuming no. 1 is untreated cushings or waiting too long or ectopic??)

 

............at the moment it doesnt quite make sense but just thought id throw that in the rink and i'll try to figure out where i heard that.

 

xoxo judy xoxox

 

i have to say ive been too busy trying to get better to think about doing myself any harm, and 6 years ago i had a granddaughter handed to me and realized how wonderful like can be .........i am suppose to be taking zoloft for my vertigo and the one reason i have not listened to the doctor and fight this so much is.........my body is falling apart, my world is falling apart, but the only thing i have going for me is my mind is really okay and i am not depressed (because i know what depression is).......i fight the zoloft because it is a mind altering drug and i dont want to lose the one thing i have going for me......same with pain meds and meds in general.........

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Having a supportive and understanding family is helpful.

 

If they understand that you may reach a point where you are not capable of dealing with stuff---then you can avoid a lot of unnecessary trouble. (Been there---done that).

 

I have feelings similar to Gracie's, there are times when---I wouldn't kill myself---but I wouldn't mind if I died.

 

I'm learning that this is just part of what ever it is that is going on in my body.

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Hmmm, definitely a hard topic that sets you up for a knife in the belly but I'll share. Many of you know I was misdiagnosed bipolar long before I even knew of the hormone cortisol. In that time I was highly volatile and frankly didn't care if I woke up. I have in some periods had suicidal tendencies and sought help. Knowing the signs yourself is your first defense. I had about a half dozen ways to go and be neat about it...(not sure why that was so important) I hated my life, my body getting so fat (a phobia from childhood thanks to my mom) the inability to function or work. I have always been an overachiever and going from 100-0 in 2.2 seconds really did me in. Obviously I'm still here to tell the tale but that was because I had a good support system. I had to learn to trust someone not to blow me off and take my feelings seriously which is still very hard to do.

 

On the positive side I was lucky and this experience strengthened my marriage. We did walk the path of me being a hypochondriac and "faker" and after a lot of counseling and forgiveness we're much stronger.

 

R

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I have especially been thinking (sometimes a lot) about suicide after the last surgery.

I have of course had my days of being depressed to the point of being sick, but never as bad as this.

 

I am depressed about the last years of my life wasted, my body, my hair, my face...you name it, and then I'm depressed for thinking that way.

 

I think one thing that makes me so depressed is the pain now. The pain is uncontrollable and I hate living like this. I know my hormones are messed up and until they are straightened out I will not get back to myself.

 

Nick, Funny you should mention the way people look on the street and comments others can make about them, because that was one of the worst things when this all started for me to deal with. I was always a petite person... the only one that could do the splits, cartwheels etc, the grand champion of the grade school at jump-roping (quit laughing :-) life was good and so was my body. Then after 30 + years of being that way I suddenly gain 100+ pounds and I got lost, drown if you will somewhere down inside of it.

I started getting the snorting teenagers, the looks, the comments because I couldn't hold my last baby, the comments from family that I needed to walk every night. Really? I never thought of that. I was rather enjoying the blubber, thanks. All when just before I went to the gym 3-4 days a week for 1 1/2-2 hours of aroebics and weights. It's not like I asked for this.

 

I have been fortunate not to have to test long or go through some of the trouble that some of you have with doctors not believing or listening yet I've still been so depressed that I thought daily of the easiest way to get out of hell.

 

Not many times have I brought up my depression with people, with the exception of a few times in my blog and a couple of close friends.

I don't tell Robert anything anymore after screaming at him "you have no idea how it feels to want to die every f-ing day of your life, and knowing you can't because of your children" That is honestly the 1 and only thing that has kept me here. I know it probably scared him but he says nothing, not one damn thing about it. At least a simple "I'm sorry you are feeling that way to aknowledge it would help. I feel like the comedians that attempt or succeed in suicide that everyone says "they had to have been happy as funny as they were"....not saying that I'm funny, just that people hide it well and cover their real feelings for others when they are dying inside.

 

All I know is that I feel like I'm being punished for something but I have no idea what or when the nightmare will end.

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*hugs*

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Phil, that's what they say about alot of serial killers, "but he seemed like such a nice guy"!!!

 

Seriously, you wonder what is going on in the inner workings of their bodies and do they do any kind of physical testing on them once they are caught.

 

Judy

 

Judy, 1st off I have to say that I am NOT a serial killer, LOL. Here is some info I found that might be interesting.

 

Web Info:

 

ADVANCED APPLIED CRIMINOLOGY

 

"Hormones are the chemical messengers of the body, produced by the endocrine glands, the brain, gastrointestinal organs, sex organs, the kidney, the heart, the pineal gland, the skin and the hair. They induce certain brain events by their secretions which prompt people to behave in certain ways to environmental stimuli. Hormonal equilibrium or homeostasis is maintained by an organ in the brain called the hypothalamus, which regulates a number of biological clocks: circadian rhythms, running activity, reproduction, menstruation, rapid-eye-movement, attention span, food preferences, migration, hibernation, singing behavior, and seasonal affective disorder. In addition, the hypothalamus is part of the Autonomic Nervous System, controlling involuntary functions. The region it's located in, the limbic system, is one of the most unmapped areas of the brain. It has been called the "crocodile" brain. One study found that 15 of 15 death row inmates had some kind of lobe dysfunction in their limbic system, so criminologists strongly suspect limbic lobe dysfunction in most cold-blooded killers.

Criminologists have been arguing for years (since 1928 actually) that criminal behavior most likely involves a glandular disorder. Males are more likely to suffer from glandular disorders, such as hyperthyroidism (which may cause personality change) and Cushing's disease (which often manifests abnormally compulsive and obsessive behavior). Males are also more likely to be right-brain dominant, which explains why left-handedness occurs one and a half times more frequently in men as well as their hunting and exploring instincts.

Testosterone, and other androgens, have been strongly linked to aggressive criminal behavior. High levels of testosterone reduce a person's social integration, making them more of a loner, freeing them up to deviate from society's norms. In men, testosterone levels peak in the mid-teens, and decline slowly over the life course. Testosterone is highest in the morning right after waking up and decreases throughout the course of the day. For some reason, it's also highest during the months of November and December.

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(((((((((Christy)))))))))))

 

Phil, I find that very interesting. I've always thought that for the most part there has to be a dissruption, if you will, in the brains (or glands) of alot of ciminals, probably mostly in the hard core & murderers. It just seems that something is misfiring. Makes you wonder what kind of physical signs, illnesses, etc were possibly present and never diagnosed.

Glad to know you're not a serial killer!!!!!!

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I need about a 50" computer monitor so that I can increase the size of the text . . . . . . my eyes have gotten so bad that I can barely read a lot of the posts . . . . . .

 

but . . . .

 

I wanted to weigh in here . . . . .

 

I totally get it . . . . .

 

Suicide . . . . . . I've thought about it so many times . . . . . and even planned it out . . . . . . but . . . . . alas, something stops me.

 

There is just enough positive left in me to say there has got to be something after all of this mess.

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Thank you for all the honesty shared in this post. It is so important to discuss even the worst of this disease here.

With all that is swirling around me now, it would be and has been easy for me to think ... why bother with this life?

This thread shows me that I am not alone, and many of us face these terribly debilitating thoughts more than we deserve to.

That makes me sad for all of us.

 

I have had suicidal thoughts off and on for about 10 years, with more regularity in the past 7 months. Probably every few weeks.

I have shared this with my husband, and I hate to see the look on his face.

He looks so disappointed, at such a loss over what to tell me, what to do for me.

It's just another bit of guilt I carry for being the sick one.

 

I am relieved to know that this is related to Cushing's, and I will go add this to my symptoms list.

It's a medical problem. It is not me. It is not my life. It is not my choices.

While my life needs vast improvement in many areas, it is not my life that makes me feel this way.

It's is this d@mn disease...

 

I didn't know what was going on with me. Thank you for helping me today.

 

It breaks my heart to know of all of us who struggle with this, but I am grateful that we are all here in this community together.

 

Hugs,

Melissa

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I have been wanting to say for some time how grateful and proud I am to know you all.

 

I sometimes see posts on the board from people that are really in emotional pain, I have posted a couple myself and every single time, someone always responds with something helpful or just showing that they care.

 

Lately, I have been battling my own demons and haven't responded to many of them, was in too dark a space of my own to have anything valuable to say (at least that is what it feels like in that space), as we go through our cycles, it is probably like that for many of us.but there are always others that jump in with kind and encouraging words.

 

It is just really comforting to know that there is a whole community that really cares when someone is down and asking for encouragement and that we take turns for each other. Even the posts that are just read help the rest of us.

 

I really think being part of this community alone is a lifesaver for finding a way through the Cushing's maze as well as dealing with the darker aspects of it.

 

Thank you!

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Melissa,

It is hard to talk about, especially in the case I talk of, I would be left behind to think I didn't try hard enough. While I know that's not true, sometimes it's hard to know.

Probably the low point for me with Justin was right around his birthday last year. He had been tallking of suicide with his friends and they would tell him to come over, and anyway it was a really bad time.

He and his dad had not been getting along, I now know because Bill suspected what Justin was really thinking (I still was naieve enough to think my love would save him & maybe it did) & was practically scared to let him out of the house.

One night Justin was talking about moving out of the house, and he meant right then, he & Bill fought, Bill went downstairs and Justin started gathering a few things, I went into his room and he leaned down and rubbed his nose on my forehead. It was probably the most heartfelt gesture he'd ever made to me. He's not real demonstative with anyone.

When he walked out the front door that night I really didn't know if I would ever see him alive again. I was afraid that he would get so overwhelmed that night or the next he might decided to act on his thoughts.

He did come home sometime the next day. but things were still pretty rocky for awhile.

When he looks too down I dread what may happen. I hope that the love from his family & friends is enough to sustain him through those times.

When things were going better with him I jokingly told him if he ever did that he would just be proving the local doctors right (because they would only say I knew he was depressed.) I however would know better, but it would not lessen the pain.

And it has been good to actually get this out in the open for me. I had felt for months like I had a dark secret that I could not share, although a very few outside our immediate family know.

Judy

 

 

edit - you are so right Sylvia, I would be total basket case without this board.

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Melissa,

 

I can say with certainty that even though I'm a hypo-pit patient.....after stupid doc induced cushings....I feel so much "Happier" after my pit surgery. They don't know what it was just as pathology is still working on it, but I can think much clearer, and my mood is sooooooo much better.

 

Could it be the relief of surgery being over.......I really don't think so. Because surgery isn't a cure for me, it was a biopsy in terms of getting it out of my body to figure out what caused me to loose pit function.

 

I read an article once......which I could find it......but it explained that the underneath side of the brain where the pit gland is, is of course attached to the hypo-thalamus. This is attached to where the "emotional" systems are in our brain. The middle, underneath section and up in the center is where the most critical aspects of our brains are. They said the reason pituitary and hypothalamus patients ALWAYS have emotional problems is because of it's placement. It is literally hanging from the limbic portion of our brains.

 

Know this..........just as bad as you feel on your worst day........you will feel equally as good again!!!

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Wow, this board is truly therapeutic!! Reading all your stories helps me so much!

 

I can truly relate to Gracie. I am a child of a parent who committed suicide. So because I don't want others thinking that I am just genetically predisposed to it...I don't tell people when I'm sad or gloomy. I don't want them freaking out & putting me on suicide watch! I haven't had specific thoughts of suicide, but I have definitely thought that if I didn't wake up tomorrow...that would be just fine. It breaks my heart to say that because I have such a wonderful, loving family and I know the pain & agony a person feels when a loved one takes their own life. You think "What could I have done to prevent this?" Of course, you can't blame yourself for what happened, but it does cross your mind.

 

As mentioned before, I have suffered the agony & pain of my Dad's suicide. But in retrospect, there was absolutely NOTHING we could have done to stop it. This is where a physician's negligence & pure malpractice came into play. I completely & totally blame his physician for it. You see, my Dad had arthritis, so he went to a local GP for treatment. He started giving him pain meds. Over the next two years, my Dad lost so much weight, people were asking us if he had cancer. He weighed 111 pounds when he died....just a skeleton. We finally found out why...the doctor was prescribing Oxycontin, Lortab 10's, Ultram, AND MORPHINE each month!!!! My Dad was hopelessly addicted to Pain Killers and that's whey he killed himself. We had no idea, we thought he was addicted, but only to Lortabs...didn't know that quack was giving him every pain killer under the sun!! This doctor has since disappeared and we have no idea where he is.

 

But this is the thing, Cushing's causes so many physical ailments, but it's like the mental dysfunction that goes along with it is totally glazed over. Why? Chemical & hormonal imbalances manifesting itself as a psychological malfunction should be just as significant as a physical malfunction. I have had so many of my patients who have dealt with depression because of longstanding chronic pain. But for some reason, doctors don't take these symptoms as seriously. For instance, if your liver is failing...well, let's get right on this, this could be deadly. But if your psyche is failing...they don't seem to get overly concerened. Well, we all know that when a person's psyche is failing, it CAN lead to death. There is such a stigma regarding mental health issues and it shouldn't be! And like I said, it should be considered just as much of a health risk as having cortisol levels 3x as high as they should be.

 

Judy, I admire you immensely and I know that this is physically & emotionally draining for you. I would most definitely contact Dr F regarding this new symptom. It's not insignificant. In my mind, it is a profoundly important piece of the puzzle and Dr F needs to be aware of it. Justin has several diagnostically high tests...if the hormonal imbalance is causing psychological damage, shouldn't this be addressed as an important issue? That's just my humble opinion.

 

Sorry for the rant. This just hits home for me and I feel strongly about this. Judy, you & your family will be in my prayers.

 

Melly, I'm so sorry that you have been touched by suicide twice in your life. No one should ever have to experience it even once. You are in my prayers too.

 

Heck...EVERYONE on this board is in my prayers cause we are all dealing with this terrible disease.

 

Much love (and again, sorry for the rant :) )

Cindy

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Cindy,

This really isn't a new symptom, I'm just afraid it's rearing it's ugly head again. I really can't remember if this came up with Dr. F in LA or not.

Justin has several diagnostically high tests, but I don't think they will be enough. I have a phone consult early in Dec. Until then I just want Justin to keep testing and pray for more highs. Justin's MRI was read as clear, I sent it to Dr. McC and he said that there was a suspicious area that might warrant an IPSS if there is enough biochemical evidence. I have forwarded that to Dr. F. but don't know what he thinks about that. Last I heard he thought Justin was just insulin resistant and had low vitamin D. I know his testosterone is low but nothing was said about that. He also thinks since Justin has lost weight that there's a strong possiblity that he doesn't have Cushings.

 

I think Justin is going to have to have ALOT of high tests and maybe needs them higher than he now has, to prove anything. I guess I'm trying to keep him off the radar for the moment until he has more highs. I don't think that at this point Justin or I either one want to hear that he needs higher numbers and more of them. The two anti depressants that were tried didn't do much. Well, actually I think Lexapro made him angry, like he needed that!!! the amatryptaline had a small affect.

 

But I still hesitate to bring this symptom up with Dr. F (if we hadn't before), I'm afraid of his reaction.

 

Judy

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Judy--

I am so sorry for what you, Justin, and Jess are going through. This is so hard.

 

Email this this article about suicide and pit tumors to Dr. F on your appt day. Bring it up. He should know. I finally let Dr. L know about me.

 

As for losing weight, I lost 30 pounds back in 2002-2003 on Atkins. I ate less than 20 carbs a day. I was vigilant.

 

Then I gained the 70 pounds I now carry. I was getting ready to be a bridesmaid in my friend's wedding, and I just lost the contract for my job. I gained 10-15 pounds in 2 months. Stress was high. I had already been measured for the dress--a silk Chinese traditional chipao dress--and when it arrived, it didn't fit. I had to go to a friend's house, have her take photos of me stuffed like sausage in that skinny dress, and send them to my bride friend so she could show the dress maker in San Francisco. They had to let out the dress and there were thread shadows on the side where they had to let out the material. Most people couldn't see it, but I knew it was there. I was mortified and so ashamed.

 

Looking back now, I know I was in a low that lead to a high. Losing weight doesn't mean you are not Cushing's.

 

How else would he explain the high midnight cortisol levels? I've researched online, and I can't seem to find any other explanation.

 

Don't give up. You all are so close.

 

Hugs,

Melissa

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Judy,

 

Please don't be afraid of Dr F's reaction to this issue Justin is dealing with. Trust me, I totally understand where you are coming from, but I would definitely tell Dr F. I don't know Dr F personally, but he sounds like he is VERY open-minded & understanding. He is a clinician & a scientist...he will take this information at face value and determine how all of this fits into the picture as a whole. You know, this symptom should not be looked at any differently than calling Dr F up & saying that Justin has swelling or aching joints. It's just another symptom and that's really the way we all need to look at it.

 

As for the meds Justin has been taking, sometimes meds just don't work because their mechanism of action doesn't even touch the areas of the brain that are dysfunctional and this may be the case with the meds that Justin has tried. And again, Dr F needs to be aware that the meds are not alleviating this symptom.

 

Whatever your decision though, I hope that Justin feels comfortable enough to keep the lines of communication open with you. I know he is confiding in his friends, I hope that he can feel comfortable enough to confide in you FIRST. I know that you have a wonderful relationship with him and I hope he keeps this in mind when he is having troubling times.

 

I was up thinking about you guys all night. I really was. Please keep us posted on how things are going. If you EVER need to talk, please PM me. As always, you all are in my prayers!

 

Hugs,

Cindy

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Dr. F does not react negatively to mental disturbance symptoms or at least he did not with me. I sobbed and told him exactly how I felt and he wrote it down and kept listening. At the end he said "I'm 99% sure you have Cushing's but we need the labs to confirm and an MRI to find the cause." Later after the end of the sobbing visit I said something to the effect of "I'll understand if you say it's in my head like everyone else..." About a week later he said, "yes it is in your head, on the pituitary specifically...."

 

He knows that cortisol screws you up psychologically and does not in any way make light of it or ignore it.

 

R

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